Keith Hunt - Let me talk about.... - Page Twohundred- twentyfour   Restitution of All Things

  Home Previous Page Next Page

Let me talk about....

Will you read it all?

                         LET ME TALK ABOUT ......


I purposely left off the last word above. For at least I will
have your attention for a few seconds. Let me talk about tithing!

Well for those who are still willing to read on, here we go, just
for a short while. I have a full in-depth study of the subject on
the Bible Study List page.

First of all, there are many "churches" that teach the law of
tithing. You may say, "Ya, well it fills their pocket" - kinda a
sceptical way of saying it, or the way some will put it who have
been in a church group that has ABUSED tithe money. And sad to
say there have been some, and are probably still some out there
that abuse money given to them.

On the other hand, and there is another hand, there are many
church organizations who do NOT abuse money given to them. One
church I know for a fact (knowing some inside facts given to me
from the inside). The Seventh Day Adventist church teaches
tithing and also above tithing  - offerings. Their full time
ministers are not paid bug bucks. New ministers get just about as
much as ministers in the SDA church for decades, some with pretty
high responsibilities. There has never been any scandal in the
SDA church over money - the abuse of it.
What have they managed to do with all their tithe and offering
money. Well yes, they do have full time ministers, which is what
many of the NT apostles were, though some like Paul also worked
at their trade, but Paul himself taught it was not wrong to be a
paid full time minister. Some cannot see that, so it is all
covered in my in-depth study on the subject.
The SDA church has build hundreds of "church buildings" around
the world, a good way to be noticed and hang out your sign, and
welcome others to your services.
They can produce a magazine, booklets, and even books, to spread
the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
They serve in helping the local poor, needy, orphans, widows, and
people in emergency need (say when their house burns to the
ground).
They help in worldwide relief work, such as in the terrible
destruction in Haiti four months ago, from that earthquake, that
hit them.
They have been able to build hospitals around the world to serve
the ill and sick, and those in accidents etc.
They have nursing homes. They have their own schools and
Universities around the world. And of course they have the
facilities like camps (they own the land etc.) for their
children, and all that is done at those camps.

Over the years I have seen and been witness to all of the above,
and I've talked to SDA ministers about how they do it all. The
bottom line is teaching tithing and offerings and NOT abusing the
money, and not paying their ministers great large sums of money;
certainly not what a doctor or skilled specialist in the medical
world would receive. Ministers in the SDA world know it is a
calling that does not pay the big money.

So an organization that handles God's money correctly from the
members' tithes and offerings, CAN DO  a mighty  GOOD work in the
world of the spiritual and physical needy. Oh, I was nearly
forgetting, the SDA church has it OWN TV channel, 24/7. Probably
has more than one.

The SDA church is a very fine example of using correctly tithes
and offering. And yes that organization does have many high paid
men and women of different trades and skills who are members.


So if you have been only part of an organization that has abused
tithes, you are yes, going to be sceptical about the thought that
there are some organizations that do not abuse tithe money, and
do a super job with it, in serving their own people as well as
others near and far.

The Churches of God, Seventh Day, are also very good stewards of
their members' tithe money. They do not have anywhere near the
numbers as the SDA church does, hence, no way near the magnitude
of the same kind of work can be done by them as is done with the
SDA organization.


SOME OF THE ARGUMENTS GIVEN
FOR NOT HAVING TO TITHE

I've found that most who argue against tithing are people who
have been abused by some organization, in that the tithe money
was used to give their ministry a big fact pay check and a fancy
life style.
That is most definitely abuse. Of course some responsibility lies
with the giver; if they see this abuse, or their church does not
have "open" accounting books for the year end, the flag of
"danger" should be waving in your eyes, and maybe it is time to
"move on out" and find a church that uses tithe money in a
correct manner. You do have a certain amount of responsibly as to
how a church's tithe money is being spent. You find ministers
living high on the hog, you better do some investigating; you can
not get at the books; time to move out.

Here are a few of the classic arguments for NOT tithing:

1. The tithes were collected by a priesthood in Israel, which
included a Temple 24/7 ritual services. The Aaron Priesthood and
Temple is gone.

Answer:

The NT church has a Priesthood, it was all just changed over to
Christ, from Judah - Hebrew 7. So as Paul said there, there was
also a need to change the law, and he had just been talking about
the tithing law.

Also, as the apostle Paul often did, he went back further in time
to before Israel and Moses. He went back to Abraham, and we also
have the example of Jacob.

Paul never directly taught tithing to the apostolic church, because
the Temple and Priesthood still stood in Jerusalem, and as that was 
ordained of God, people were free to still tithe to that institution.
The book of Hebrews was written shortly before Jerusalem and the Temple
and Priesthood would come to a stop, hence Paul gave chapter 7 on
the tithing issue.

2. A real classic argument then is:

Well should I also ask for a blessing before I tithe like Jacob,
inferring, if you bless me Lord I'll tithe.

Answer:

Jacob was very carnal at times. So maybe only those who are lust
grabbing with the Lotto tickets for millions - well yes we should
make them tithe for sure, they've been blessed so they should
tithe (sometimes winner for them as been a curse), and the rest
of us can ignore the law. The filthy rich from oil or land, if
they did not ask for a blessing and then they would tithe, they
maybe should not tithe as they never asked for a blessing first,
their riches just fell into their pockets. And so it can go. The
filthy rich CEO because he did not ask to be blessed and then he
would tithe, like Jacob once did, but the riches came his way because 
he was just a bright guy who played the game with expertise, so
doesn't have to tithe.
People would get around the law by saying, "Well I'll just make
sure I do NOT ask to be blessed before I'll tithe; I'll make sure I
do NOT do a Jacob, and I'm free from having to tithe."

3. With Abraham - only tithed on "war articles" when he rescued
Lot in a battle.

Answer:

Ah, I see, it is the soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan and the USA
and coalition countries that should be tithing (they take over
some land, oh, could be valuable, could have many farmers,
farming away, or they have donkeys, camels, sheep, goats). Ah now
under USA control - oh the army should be tithing, while the rest
of us get off scott-free. The army guys/gals should tithe, and we
can build our barns by the dozen and stack our physical stuff in
them. I think Jesus had something to say about that in the
Gospels.

4.

Tithing was done in Israel on agriculture things only. 

Answer:

Oh was it really? Hummmmm, so it is the farmers, who often have
to work 80 hours a day in some parts of the season. I see, they
are to diligently tithe, while the shoemaker (which is one of my
skilled trades by the way) - he does not have to tithe at all.
Well isn't that nice for my the shoemaker. Weeelllll I wonder how
many would stay in the agriculture business it that had indeed
been the law.
How many today would stay in agriculture in the Western world if
that was the law?

So let me see now, all the Western Ranchers would have to tithe;
all the orchard farmers would have to tithe; all the grain
farmers would have to tithe; all the sheep farmers would have to
tithe etc. while the rest of us, we could laugh and shake our
head and say, "Foolish on you," you should come and be a plumber
like me, or a baker, a shoe-maker or candle-slick maker.

Do you really believe Israel would have had peace internally over
such a way as running a tithing system this way. It would have
been enough for civil war, and then such a war taking place, and
why it happened, over what issues, would be all over the Old
Testament.

Additional answer:

Most scholars who have studied Jewish history and teaching, will
readily see that Israel had 3 tithing system. The first tithe,
which most know about. The second tithe was for use at the
Festivals, And the third tithe was for the priest, widow, orphan,
collected every 3rd year and 6th year out of seven.

The second tithe was to go with you to observe the Feast of the
Lord three times  a year (if possible - those Jews living far
away after Judah's Babylon captivity, it was not possible). Now
the farmers and orchardists, they could keep the second tithe and
travel to Jerusalem (Shiloh before that). The farmers, well they
had their second tithe and away they could go to observe God's
Feasts, they had the money/cattle - they were tithing for these
three events each year. But the shoemaker, the tent maker, the
carpenter etc, no second tithe for them, as we are taught they
did not have to tithe, for tithing was only on agriculture, so
goes the argument. Hence how did they get to the Festivals and
have a good time? I guess they just got there if they could, when
they could, maybe this year and maybe not again for 10 years,
while the agricultural fellow had to tithe and the males appear
before the Lord three times a year at the Feasts, each year.


Are you seeing HOW UTTERLY STUPID are these arguments. Israel
would have been constantly fight and rioting among themselves,
over such a crazy law that discriminated one from the other, when
it came to tithing. Tithing was only given details in agriculture
in the books of Moses, because tithing for them was dealing with
physical animals and grain. A shoe-maker, carpenter and such
trades, pretty easy to figure a tithe on your profit; just as
easy to figure a tithe if you were employed by someone and
received a pay-check.

God has never been a "respecter of persons" for anything, sin,
righteousness, or tithing. He has never had one law for one while
no law for others. In fact it is written in the law, that there
would be ONE law for both the Israelite and the none-Israelite -
yes it's in the books of Moses, look it up.

Such is the folly of people who will find any excuse they can to
hang on to every penny they get, or just want to be a cheerful
giver, when they want to give, which gives them the freedom to
hardly ever give. It the same old story - they do not want God
telling them what to do and that He claims 10 percent from their
pay-check. If it was not for God you'd have nothing anyway, or
put it another way, everything belongs to God, but He's willing
to let you keep 90 percent of it, less some offerings now and
then.

Well just some recent thoughts, from some arguments that recently
came my way!

Oh, last time I looked Matthew 23:23 and Matthew 5:17-19 was
still in the Bible. And so was Luke 17:10, and put that with
Matthew 25:14-30 .... woooowwww ..... get the picture?

                                                  ...................................


To be continue from time to time.


  Home Previous Page Top of Page Next Page

 
Navigation List:
 

 
Word Search:

PicoSearch
  Help